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Mp5 and +Healing

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Hey,

So in some guides quoted on the interweb about shaman healing you'll find it said that 1 mp5 is equal in value to something like 5 +healing. I ran some calculations the other day that I will repeat here which are the basis of why I consider 1 mp5 actually closer to 2-3 +healing in value.

The calculations are based on this thought:
"How much +healing do I need to cast a spell at a lower level while still getting the same healing done as the higher level spell. And vice versa, how much mp5 do I need to cast a higher level spell while still spending the same amount of mana as if I were casting a lower level spell."

Let's get to it.

In my example of how to do the calculations I'll be using Chain Heal R1 and R2 as a resto specced shaman:

R1: 247 mana - 379 healing
R2: 299 mana - 479 healing

52 mana difference.
100 healing difference.

Chain Heal is a 2.5 second cast which means it gets 2.5 / 3.5 = 0.714 of +healing applied to it.

100 / 0.714 = 140 +healing required for R1 to become equal to R2.

So we've established that you'll need +140 healing to basically use R1 instead of R2. By using R1 instead of R2 we are saving 52 mana per cast, or 104 mana per five seconds. So for this example we do 140 / 104 = 1.34, meaning 1mp5 = 1.34 +heal.

Then we can basically do the same thing for all the different ranks. I'll save you the time since I made a spreadsheet for this already:

CH R1-2: 1.34
CH R2-3: 1.39
HW R5-6: 1.77
HW R6-7: 1.96
HW R7-8: 1.99
HW R8-9: 2.09
HW R9-10: 3.05
LHW R1-2: 1.82
LHW R2-3: 1.92
LHW R3-4: 2.05
LHW R4-5: 2.10
LHW R5-6: 2.29

Notice that Healing Wave R10 is a serious outlier, but obviously it will rarely be used. Regardless the average mp5 value is equal to 1.98 +healing but as you can see it's more valuable when using Healing Wave or Lesser Healing Wave (especially the higher ranks). Also keep in mind that mp5 has value while dropping totems and running around. Despite few fights involving a lot of those things (how many times do you spend 10+% of the fight not casting?) I think it's fair to say that on average 1mp5 is worth 2-3 healing.

Let me know if you want me to clarify something.
Posted Nov 13, 17 · OP
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Awesome, cheers mate!
Posted Nov 14, 17
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These numbers only compare the +healing and differential in mana between spell ranks and fails to take into account the base cost of the initial rank spell. It's not a faithful way to interpret HEP values as the premise is faulty.

Basically what you have calculated is the MP5 to +healing EP specifically between different ranks of skills.

Can you lay out for me specifically how you calculated those values? Did you include CH bounces? Did you get base heal values on a naked character? How did you go about scaling up your +healing? Etc.
When in doubt, theorycraft.
Posted Jan 9, 18 · Last edited Jan 9, 18
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wrote:
These numbers only compare the +healing and differential in mana between spell ranks and fails to take into account the base cost of the initial rank spell. It's not a faithful way to interpret HEP values as the premise is faulty.

As stated in the post the premise is:
"How much +healing do I need to cast a spell at a lower level while still getting the same healing done as the higher level spell. And vice versa, how much mp5 do I need to cast a higher level spell while still spending the same amount of mana as if I were casting a lower level spell."

wrote:
Basically what you have calculated is the MP5 to +healing EP specifically between different ranks of skills.

Indeed, as was my intention and I think I succeeded.

If I understand your post correctly you would rather want to compare one rank to itself and understand how +mp5 and +healing would increase its effectiveness. This is of course another premise that certainly deserves its own ground, but my guess is that the results would simply be "mp5 will sustain you longer while +healing will give you more HPS".

To even calculate on that premise you would probably need to define your parameters more closely, but in the effort of trying I'll do some (semi)open-ended napkin math:

Chain Heal R1: 247 mana - 379 healing, receiving 0.714 of +healing and taking a total of 2.5 seconds to cast

I can immediately see one parameter that would have to be fixed: Mana pool (and, in turn, current regeneration). Without it we cannot see how many Chain Heals you can squeeze out in addition per point of mp5 and therefore find out the overall healing that single point of mp5 would provide. To be able to continue let's just assume that you have 7410 mana and no regeneration, allowing you to cast Chain Heal R1 exactly 30 times before going oom:

0mp5 & 0heal: 30 * 379 = 11370 healing done total

+1mp5 would grant a total of 15 mana over 30 casts of 2.5 seconds each, meaning an additional 30 / 247 = 0.1215 extra Chain Heal R1's.

1mp5 & 0 heal: 30.1215 * 379 = 11416 healing done total, an increase of 46 healing

+1heal would grant a total of 0.714 healing to every cast, but the cast amount would not change, so this is easy enough to calculate.

0mp5 & 1 heal: 30 * 379.714 = 11391 healing done total, an increase of 21 healing

That should mean that with +2heal you've reached approximately the value of +1mp5 (42 vs 46 healing done total).

Correct me if I'm wrong, it could obviously be that you were meaning something else entirely when you were speaking of the premise this should be built on. Currently I'm inclined to stick to my guns though.

wrote:
Can you lay out for me specifically how you calculated those values? Did you include CH bounces? Did you get base heal values on a naked character? How did you go about scaling up your +healing? Etc.

I basically just found the ranks on db.vanillagaming.org and applied the resto shaman talent bonuses to them (reduced mana per cast, increased healing on the base). I did not bother to double check if they were close to right, I just assumed they were. The base heal values were taken from an average calculation of what the db claims the lowest and highest value possible is, with the addition of the talent of course. The +healing scale was just based on the good old formula of cast time / 3.5 = scaling. I did not include CH bounces, this applies to single target only.
Posted Thu at 03:13 pm · OP
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After pondering my last post further, as well as your post Egregious, I understand now that the premise of my previous (not the original, the previous) post is faulty in the sense that I should not have used Chain Heal as an example.

The napkin math I posted has the correct thought and calculations behind it (I believe), but only on single target healing spells (Lesser Healing Wave and Healing Wave). Because the chains from Chain Heal are "free" (or rather, extra) their high base should be amplified further with increased casts instead of the minor amount of increased healing they receive from +healing. I am therefore going to redo it for Chain Heal:

Chain Heal R1: 247 mana - 379 + 190 + 94 healing (663 healing done total), receiving 0.714 of +healing on the initial cast and taking a total of 2.5 seconds to cast

Let's again assume that you have 7410 mana and no regeneration, allowing you to cast Chain Heal R1 exactly 30 times before going oom:

0mp5 & 0heal: 30 * 663 = 19890 healing done total

+1mp5 would grant a total of 15 mana over 30 casts of 2.5 seconds each, meaning an additional 30 / 247 = 0.1215 extra Chain Heal R1's.

1mp5 & 0 heal: 30.1215 * 663 = 19970 healing done total, an increase of 80 healing

+1heal would grant a total of 0.714 healing to the initial cast, but the cast amount would not change, so this is easy enough to calculate.

0mp5 & 1 heal: 30 * 379.714 + 189.857 + 94.929 (664.5 total) = 19936 healing done total, an increase of 46 healing

That should mean that with +2heal you've reached approximately the value of +1mp5 (92 vs 80 healing done total).

Wow, I must admit I'm surprised. I really thought this would change things to be in favor of mp5 but it's still the same result. Well, as before: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I guess I'm still inclined to stick to my guns.
Posted Tue at 01:52 pm · OP
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